“The city’s been slowly, as part of the City of Vernon’s Climate Action Plan, transferring out all of our old city vehicles and replacing them with electric vehicles.” — Torrie Silverthorn

Electrification is transforming transportation worldwide, and Vernon, British Columbia, is embracing the movement with its own unique twist—electric Zambonis. These eco-friendly icons of Canadian hockey culture aren’t just cutting emissions, they’re also showcasing Vernon’s commitment to sustainability. As part of the City’s Climate Action Plan, electrification is turning heads and setting a new standard in sports tourism that reflects the values that make Vernon a standout destination.

In this episode of Travel Beyond, we start by speaking with Torrie Silverthorn, Manager of Tourism for the City of Vernon. Torrie discusses how destination marketing has evolved to align with visitors’ growing interest in hiking, cycling, and sustainable experiences. She also shares how the city is weaving sustainability into every aspect of its operations, including the electrification of city vehicles—an initiative that even extends to hockey, a cornerstone of the community’s culture.

Next, we speak with Jonny Rockall, owner of the Pedego Oyama e-bike store as well as the Arena Attendant and zamboni driver for the City of Vernon. Jonny shares how his background as a mountain bike racer ultimately paved the way for his e-bike business amid the growing trend of electrification. He also dives into the details of the electric Zambonis, explaining how they cut greenhouse gas emissions, enhance indoor air quality in arenas, and are “environmentally friendly, much more efficient, and significantly cheaper to operate.” These values not only advance sustainable solutions but also shape the character of Vernon as a destination. 

In this episode of Travel Beyond, you’ll learn:

• How retrofitted Zambonis are improving air quality and saving money for the City of Vernon, among other benefits.
• How cycling and electrification are on the rise in Vernon.
• About the Okanagan Rail Trail and an increase in e-bikes as a visitor experience and form of transportation.
• About hockey’s cultural significance in Canada.
• How another energy-saving innovation is keeping ice rinks smooth in Vernon.

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With thanks to Tourism Vernon for sponsoring this episode of Travel Beyond.

Show notes

Kal Tire Place — An NHL and international-sized 3,003-seat multi-purpose arena located in Vernon, British Columbia. 

Okanagan Rail Trail — A 50-kilometer multi-use trail converted from a former railway line.

Pedego Oyama — A store for sales and rentals of Pedego electric bikes in Vernon, British Columbia. 

Zamboni — An ice resurfacer vehicle for cleaning and smoothing the surface of an ice rink. 

Episode transcript

Torrie Silverthorn: The hockey culture is alive and well here. It’s an important aspect of tourism in bringing people to the community for tournaments. It’s kind of crazy, uh, to think that a Zamboni could be electrified. 

Jonny Rockall: I mean, there’s a huge greenhouse gas emissions reduction. So, you know, it improves the inside, the indoor air quality.

There’s so many dynamics with an ice rink that people don’t know about. So to be able to update it and then have, you know, have you use up this machine a little bit more and, and um, save all that waste. That’s a good thing.

David Archer: Hello and welcome to Travel Beyond, where we partner with leading destinations to explore the greatest challenges facing communities and the planet, surfacing their most inspiring solutions. I’m David Archer from Destination Think, and I’m recording from Haida Gwaii, the territory of the Haida Nation off the north coast of British Columbia in Canada.

On this show, we look at the role of travel and choose to highlight destinations that are global leaders. We talked to the change makers who are addressing regenerative travel through action in their communities and often from the bottom up lately on the podcast, we’ve talked about large scale innovations and challenges related to carbon removal, sustainable aviation, fuel airlines, and offsets.

But this time we’re going to land the plane, so to speak, and zoom in to visit a destination where electric vehicles and related innovations are starting to appear, and they’re having a big impact on tourism experiences. Electrifying transportation is one way that tourism destinations and travelers can reduce carbon emissions.

And in the long run, they save money on maintenance and fuel, and that applies at the local level. In the city of Vernon, British Columbia, electrification extends into the hockey arena. This is a small city located in the Okanagan region, an area known for lakes, orchards, and wineries. Sports tourism is another major focus for Verden.

And, for example, many people visit the local arenas for hockey and ringette tournaments throughout the year. And every hockey tournament needs a Zamboni. Retrofitted electric Zambonis are now part of the City of Vernon’s fleet of e vehicles. Two upgraded machines and one brand new electric Zamboni have allowed arena attendants to take care of the ice while eliminating the indoor air pollution caused by burning propane fuel.

And there are other benefits too. We’ll hear all about them today. We speak with a guest with firsthand experience with two forms of electric transportation. Johnny Rockall is known as a local cycling legend, and he now owns and operates an e bike business in the region. He also, to the envy of Canadian kids and grownups everywhere, maybe he gets to drive the Zamboni on the city’s ice rinks as an arena attendant for the city of Vernon.

He’s going to tell us all about the electric Zamboni innovations, as well as one more surprising energy saving solution the city of Vernon has installed in the arena. This episode we also discuss cycling and e bikes as a growing trend, and I spoke with Tori Silverthorn at Tourism Vernon to learn about the city as a tourism destination, about cycling in the local area, the impact of sports tourism, and about the importance of ice sports to local culture.

Here’s my conversation with Tori. 

Well, welcome to Travel Beyond. It’s great to have you here today. 

Torrie Silverthorn: Thanks for having me. 

David Archer: Yeah, you bet. First of all, can you tell us your name and what you do? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Sure. My name’s Tori Silverthorne. I’m the manager of tourism for the city of Vernon. So we’re, we’re a destination marketing organization, like Tourism Vancouver.

Uh, but we’re also a department within the municipality. So I am. Uh, the head of a DMO, but I also work for local government. It’s an odd mix, but it’s really interesting. 

David Archer: Right. How long have you lived in Vernon? 

Torrie Silverthorn: I’ve lived in Vernon for about 15 years now. I’m originally from Saskatchewan and I grew up coming to Vernon as a tourist.

David Archer: Um, yeah, what do you like most about living in Vernon or what drew you to the city? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Oh the outdoor experiences. Um, there’s a true four seasons here. Every season is different and beautiful and very, um, accessible in terms of it’s not, it’s never 40 below. Um, and it’s never too, too hot. Like it’s just, it’s always a nice temperature.

It’s always good weather. And there’s mountains and lakes and a valley and orchard and a ski hill 20 minutes from my doorstep. And, um, also it’s a very friendly, genuine community. Um, with an international airport nearby. So it has, has everything I was looking for. 

David Archer: Great, yeah, it sounds like it, uh, Vernon’s good at getting you outside too.

Torrie Silverthorn: Very much so, yes. And we’re the trails capital of BC, so our trails are, we have a trail for everybody here, is what we like to say. 

David Archer: Right. Yeah. And, um, I’ve spoken with Jonny Rockall, our next guest. Uh, and he was telling me a bit about the Okanagan rail trail. I suppose that’s one of the, one of the trails that makes you the capital.

Torrie Silverthorn: Oh, if you were to come to Vernon and people do ask me this as the tourism manager, if there was only one thing for me to do, what would you do? And I would say rent an e bike or get on your e bike or a regular bike, whichever you prefer, and spend the afternoon on the Okanagan rail trail, biking. Along a 0 percent grade trail along one of the most beautiful lakes in Canada, Kalamaka Lake, and it doesn’t matter what time of year it is.

It’s an iconic experience and you’ll love it. So I hope you can come and try it sometime, sometime, David. 

David Archer: Yeah, I’d love to. That sounds great. So what do you think makes Vernon a special place to visit? What, what types of visitors are drawn to Vernon, would you say? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Uh, we spent a lot of time talking about this and we just finished developing a new five year strategy.

And that’s the, that was the crux, that was the question. That was the question. And, um, it’s an independent minded outdoor lover. Yeah. Is the person who loves Vernon, which, um, I know a lot of them that are here and visit here every year. And so people that visit Vernon are often following their own path.

They don’t want to go to the typical tourist trap destination. They don’t want long lines. They want to have an authentic experience. Um, and then they, they want to spend the bulk of their time outdoors doing great things. Uh, whether it be on a trail in a lake. Skiing, hiking, biking, um, any of those things and you can do all of those things in Vernon.

David Archer: And would you say cycling is a popular activity? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Yeah, I’d say it’s our fastest growing, um, sector at the moment. Mountain biking in particular, um, the Silver Star Bike Park just up the mountain in 20 minutes. Um, is getting international attention right now for its trail system. And, um, just what an epic ride you can have up there, um, and then take a chairlift from the bottom to the top when you’re done.

Um, yeah, yeah, yeah. Lots of mountain bikers here in the area and coming specifically for the mountain biking. 

David Archer: Has that changed over time or, or how have you noticed Vernon changing, I guess, during your time there? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Good question. So when I first joined, uh, Tourism Vernon, um, in the marketing department, it was very much so, uh, get the Albertans here on their boat.

And they would come and hang out in their cabins or their second homes. Um, but they were here to boat and be on the beach and do, like, the peaches and beaches, we call it, kind of thing. 

David Archer: Yep. Well, that worked on my family, I’ll tell you, as an ex Albertan. 

Torrie Silverthorn: Yeah, it worked on me, too. It’s great. It’s, yeah, there’s nothing wrong with peaches and beaches and being on a boat.

Um, but we’ve seen a shift towards, um, It’s the more, uh, I guess what we were just talking about, the, the mountain biking and hiking and people wanting that, honestly, more sustainable experience. They, there’s still the people that are into motorboating and they are welcome here. Uh, but we really like to encourage them, the biking and hiking and use of the trails because it’s more sustainable and, um, we have a lot of them and it’s a great way to Experience the outdoors and get around the community too.

So, um, that’s the major shift I’ve seen is the activities. People still want to be outside, but what they want to do outside is different. 

David Archer: Yeah, that makes sense. Um, how about, I mean, I’m sure that the emphasis on trails and some of these outdoor activities in new ways make a difference for the residents of Vernon as well.

Do you notice people using bikes as transportation more often these days or has there been a change that way? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Yes, there is a shift happening. We still recognize that as most Canadian communities are, there’s so much land. And Vernon, uh, is a medium sized community does cover a fair amount of space. So we are still a driving, uh, driving community, but at the same time, we’re investing heavily right now, the municipality in particular, in developing our greenways.

You can, it’s easier, you can bike from one end of town to the other. It’s just a long ways to go and not everybody can do it. But e bikes are really changing that game too. 

David Archer: Right. So I know that sports tourism is an important part of the, the tourism equation in Vernon. Can you tell me what kinds of sporting events are held in the city?

Torrie Silverthorn: Oh, sure. Yeah. Everything. We host a little bit of everything. Um, but, uh, and we talk a lot about, um, trail running and mountain biking and cycling because it’s our fastest growing sector, but what’s really gotten us to this point, which is to, to be a growing destination is, um, I like to think of it as our bread and butter is our team sports like hockey.

Okay. Um, and like ringette, um, we have had large, uh, hockey tournaments and ringette tournaments coming here year over year over year, whether it be, uh, Pee Wee, Bantam, um, or the, Vipers League. Like we have All ages and abilities coming here for, for ice time and tournament time. And with them, they bring their families and they fill hotels and they visit the restaurants and the businesses.

So, um, we call them our specific sport sector, but it’s really, it’s really the ice. It’s the ice, um, the ice sports and we love them and they’re great to our community. 

David Archer: So tell us a little bit about Kal Tire Place as one of the venues in question today because we’re going to talk about Zambonis, which is always a fun thing.

Um, yeah. Tell us about Kal Tire Place and what goes on there. I suppose it’s a lot of the tournaments. 

Torrie Silverthorn: So Kal Tire Place is a, is a great, um, uh, facility. And, um, I didn’t play hockey growing up, but I grew up in a family of boys and all of them were really into hockey. So I can appreciate, uh, the facility that we have here for a medium sized city.

So we’ve got great seating capacity and a nice sheet of ice and a great concession. And then we also have Kal Tire Place North. So another, uh, sheet of ice just, um, adjoining to Kal Tire Place and Ice time is constantly booked and um, yeah, we have some great events in there. Not just sport, but we’ve had a few great concerts and things like that.

But yeah, it’s, it’s a great facility. And we, we pump through tournaments all the time, like nobody’s business. So it’s a, it’s a busy place. 

David Archer: Yeah, it sounds like it. Um, so I know the city of Vernon has been adding some electric vehicles to its fleet, and that includes a couple of Zambonis that have been retrofitted as electric vehicles.

Is that right? 

Torrie Silverthorn: Yeah, that’s right. It’s kind of crazy to think that a Zamboni to be electrified. I’m actually looking out the window right now, uh, from my office at one of the other electric city vehicles. That the building department drives around and yeah, the city’s been slowly, um, as part of, uh, the city of Vernon’s climate action plan, uh, transferring out all of our old city vehicles and replacing them with electric vehicles.

And the Zambonis fall under that, under that category. So it’s, it’s a really unique, cool thing. Um, and I didn’t realize that other places that I didn’t realize how unique this was. Um, until I learned a little bit more about it. So it’s cool. 

David Archer: Yeah. Yeah. Electrification of transport is becoming, you know, more and more common around the world.

And we’ve been, we’ve been hearing from some different people about that on the Travel Beyond podcast. Um, and I suppose, you know, in a way the Zamboni is just another form of transportation. Have you seen the new Zambonis in action yet? 

Torrie Silverthorn: I have. Yeah. I’m not going to lie. I didn’t realize they were electric though.

They look the same. Yeah. Um, they just, they sound a little bit different, but they work the exact same as the Zambonis I’ve seen everywhere else across Canada. They just are better for the environment. 

David Archer: Tell me a little bit about hockey’s impact on local culture. Like why is it important to the city of Verne as a sport?

Torrie Silverthorn: Hockey is so Canadian. Um, I, I can’t think of anything that proves that more than the Oilers. Um, oh, that’s still a sore point, but, um. 

David Archer: Yeah, as we’re recording this, they’ve just lost the Stanley Cup final, unfortunately. 

Torrie Silverthorn: I know, but how excited was our entire nation that we had the chance to bring the Cup back to Canada again?

And granted we lost it in game seven, but, um, nobody cares more about hockey more than Canada. So, um, and Vernon’s no different. The hockey culture is alive and well here. It’s an important aspect of tourism and bringing people to the community for tournaments. But, uh, to live and be part of the community, um, hockey is a part of most people’s lives here.

And so getting up early and spending the weekend at Kal Tire Place for a tournament or traveling to another community, um, is. Yeah, it’s ingrained in the culture and um, hockey is very Canadian and Vernon is very Canadian and um, The sport of hockey and ice sports in general is at the heart of it 

David Archer: Looking ahead. Um, is there anything that you’re looking forward to at the city of Vernon? It seems like Uh it sustainability wise. I mean, um, the zambonis are sort of a Um, you know a symbol of of change you might say in that Area, um, as it’s something that hasn’t been happening in too many other places Yeah, as you look ahead, are there any other sustainability efforts that you want to point out? 

Torrie Silverthorn: I can speak to specifically tourism Vernon’s aspect of like the municipality’s climate action plan and what we intend to do. And in general, um as a community from a tourism perspective, um you we don’t even really talk about ourselves as a sustainable destination. We just want to be a sustainable destination.

So, for example, we’re not interested in growing and attracting people on mass. We want to attract more thoughtful guests. We want to prioritize that over Profit, essentially. It’s not that profit and revenue and attracting visitors isn’t important to us, but we want to attract somebody that’s going to come to our community and be interested in riding the trails rather than perhaps a motorboat the entire time they’re here.

We want to attract people that will come camping and enjoy the campgrounds, but leave no trace when they leave. And we want to invite people that, um, You know, we’re installing electric charging stations for EVs all over the community, including supercharging stations for Teslas, and we want to make it easier to come here in your electric vehicle.

And so we want to make sure that, um, even in our marketing content for Tourism Vernon, that it’s easy to find that information and how you can travel here and stay here in a more sustainable way. Um, and then just our whole approach to tourism in general, as I was kind of mentioning, we don’t, we’re not interested in being a tourist trap and attracting people at all costs.

Um, our ultimate goal really is to attract people here that are going to fall in love with the community and either return here year after year and fall in love with it and also learn to respect it. Um, and, and the nature that surrounds it. Uh, the best case scenario, they actually move here and invest here long term in the community.

And so, um, I guess what I’m trying to say is at the heart of our marketing is a long term vision for, um, a more sustained, slower growth in the community rather than like this big boom that we’ve seen happen in other communities and they can’t keep up and they end up, you know, Sacrificing the environment or more sustainable options to keep up with the, with the quick builds.

That would be, that would be, I guess, a high level overview. Um, there’s more tactical examples like, like the Zambonis that are happening. Um, and, and our electric fleet at the City of Vernon. Um, but I would say just in general, it’s kind of, we’re trying to ingrain it in everything we do. 

David Archer: Yeah. Behind all those decisions are many, many other hours spent working on it, but it sounds like people are, have been very receptive to the sorts of things coming as a result of the climate action plan, for example, or some of these other initiatives.

Torrie Silverthorn: Yeah, they are. Yeah. I think in general, we have a very supportive community and environmentally conscious community, which is just hard to find sometimes. 

David Archer: Yeah, that’s good to hear and, and um, I hope that uh, Tourism Vernon can be an inspiration to other destinations, looking over their shoulders at what else is going on out there.

Um, so I wanted to thank you for your time today, Tori, and thanks for being with us on the show. 

Torrie Silverthorn: Thanks for having me, David. That was fun. 

David Archer: That was Tory Silverthorne from Tourism Vernon. Thanks again Tory for being part of the show. Next, as I mentioned, we’re going to hear from Zamboni driver and e bike entrepreneur Jonny Rockall.

He’ll tell us all about the e vehicles he uses and shares with visitors every day, including the retrofitted Zambonis. Here’s my chat with Johnny Rockall. 

Jonny Rockall: I am Jonny Rockall, owner of Pedego Oyama electric bikes in Oyama, BC, between Vernon and Kelowna on the Okanagan Rail Trail. And, uh, this is what I do.

And, uh, and, and the off season when it’s slow here, I, uh, I work part time for the city of Vernon, uh, in the arena department driving the Zamboni. 

David Archer: Excellent. And can you tell us where you’re from originally? Have you always been in Vernon? 

Jonny Rockall: Born in London, England, moved to Ottawa when I was six, uh, and then moved to, um, BC from Ottawa.

About 24 or 5 years ago. Just been in the Okanagan from the coast here for the last 11 years, so. 

David Archer: And what drew you to the Okanagan? 

Jonny Rockall: You know, really it was about the kids. We, we had, um, uh, we have four kids. So, doing that in North Vancouver, uh, where they were all born was difficult. Given, um, the rising cost of, uh, and, uh, the traffic and just the different lifestyle in the Okanagan.

The kids have all kind of grown up here, so it’s, it’s been great. 

David Archer: That’s great. What do you like most about living in Vernon? 

Jonny Rockall: You know, obviously the summers, summers are awesome here. It’s, uh, it’s pretty hot and there’s some great beaches, lakes. Um, there’s great mountain biking. There’s great, um, just bike riding in general.

And, you know, obviously slower pace. If it takes you 10 minutes to get somewhere in Vernon, that’s, that took a while. It took a long time. There must’ve been some traffic, but, um, that’s just getting out of your driveway in North Vancouver. So. 

David Archer: Yeah, exactly. So we’ll talk a little bit about electric vehicles here in a moment, but first, can you tell us about your background in cycling?

I know you’ve done quite a lot. 

Jonny Rockall: Yeah. I mean, um, when I was in Ottawa, I was, uh, me and a group of friends started racing mountain bikes and I got into it a little bit more seriously. I had one buddy I started traveling with and we started racing, you know, Canadian national races, us races, um, world cups.

Mountain biking, um, downhill specifically. It’s, it’s a pretty volatile sport. You know, it’s, uh, the race can be over in a matter of a second. Um, you know, when you spend, you spend a lot of time and resources getting to the race and hoping that you have a good result and the, at the end of the day, it’s a hobby anyway, but it was an expensive hobby.

So I decided I wanted to stay in the, stay in that area, uh, but, you know, maybe make some money instead. So I was the team mechanic for Rocky Mountain Bikes in 98 and 99, did a bunch of traveling with them, mostly California, Colorado, Utah. I did some European trips with World Cups, but yeah, a couple of years doing that.

And then I moved into various roles at Rocky Mountain Bikes in Vancouver. Doing, um, research and developments, team management stuff, um, quality control, uh, in, and then ending in U. S. sales, uh, so I had Washington, Oregon as a, as a territory. You know, being from B. C., being from North Vancouver, it’s, that’s the epicenter of mountain biking and, um, free riding, where the focus of mountain biking was back then, it was, uh, it was huge.

Thank you very much. And it wasn’t until I got to Vernon that I eventually, I started working part time at, uh, with the arenas, just to fill some, fill some gaps. And then I got a job as a firefighter at the Micah Hydroelectric Dam, uh, 140k north of Revelstoke. And, It was awesome. It was a great gig. Awesome guys.

Awesome facility. I’m working for BC hydro. No complaints only that it took me away from the family for two weeks at a time. So it was two weeks on, two weeks off. During that time, I started negotiating for Pedego electric bikes in Oyama for this business. And, uh, it took a little bit of time. It took about a year and a half to, um, to get it figured out, but eventually it did.

And, um, and here we are. So I quit fire, um, quit that job March 29th. We closed the deal on March 31st of 2023 and, uh, started owning it April 1st. 

David Archer: That’s a quick turnaround straight out of firefighting and into electric bikes. Quite a journey. What got you interested in e bikes as a business? 

Jonny Rockall: Being, you know, I’ve done a lot of mountain biking trips.

I’ve done a lot of road biking. I’ve done a lot of human powered cycling and I could just see the benefit of And, and what it offers to everybody, you know, if you’re, if you’re a hardcore season fit biker, there’s space for an e bike in your life. If you’re 50, 60, 70 years old, you haven’t ridden a bike in 20 years and you got some bad knees and, and there was never a thought to get back on a bicycle.

But now all of a sudden, e bikes are here, and they’re comfortable, they fit everybody, there’s um, there’s an option for everybody. 

David Archer: So, accessibility is a part of this for you. 

Jonny Rockall: Yeah, exactly. I mean, I just saw the, I saw the potential for it for sure after riding one myself and then experiencing knowing and loving bicycles and the bicycle riding experience.

I thought, well, this is great. And this location where my business is, is spectacular. It’s, um, you know, right on the Okanagan Rail Trail. I’m in a farm market, um, little area, I’m on a farm with a, with an amazing Italian pizzeria. The, the three of us are right here. We’re kind of symbiotic in our existence.

We, you know, we each, each thing brings in people and, and, um, it’s just an awesome destination and it offers, uh, people a view of what this region has. So you can get, you can be 70 years old. You haven’t ridden a bike in 20 years. Get on and ride 40 kilometers up and down the rail trail to from Oyama to Vernon.

People break a sweat, but some people don’t, you know, and uh, and you can do it. And I think the biggest thing is what people don’t realize is the cognitive stimulation that you get. They haven’t been on a bike in 20 years. They’re experiencing this old feeling that they remember with that they loved, but they’re also getting it a bit easier, a bit quicker.

They’re covering a bit more ground. Um, so that brain stimulation, what’s coming at them is so much more elevated and for them to have that experience at that age when they, you know, never thought that would, it was going to happen again. It, it’s surprising, it’s, um, it’s freedom. And a lot of my customers, I would say, you know, 99 percent of my customers come back from a bike rental is so happy, so pumped and just saying, you know, it was amazing.

David Archer: That’s great to hear. For those who haven’t been to Vernon yet, can you tell us a bit about the Okanagan Rail Trail? 

Jonny Rockall: Yeah, it’s an old decommissioned railway line, uh, Canadian National Railway line that, um, it’s, it, I mean, it was, was here not that long ago, uh, I mean, around 15 years ago, and it just runs north south, connects all these communities, so when they decided to, um, convert it to a multi use trail.

They got each community along the trail to, you know, purchase their, their part and refinish it. And so in different communities, there was obviously some communities have more money than others. And, and, uh, so it ranged from lots of fundraising and donations. To just, you know, people, the communities being able to just get it done.

And they’re still working on it. North of us, up near Sicamous, is under construction and going to be opened soon. It connects Vernon to Kelowna. There’s one little section that’s still going through some, some details of getting open. But the trail is there. As soon as it’s ready to be opened, it’s going to take, it’s a matter of days for it to be ready, and that will connect that entire Kelowna community to, uh, the north, to us, and to Vernon.

You know, it’s 20 kilometers from Oyama to Vernon, but be able to cover the ground between all the nice sites easily on an e bike, there’s nothing like it. It’s the only way to really see the rail trail. 

David Archer: Do most of your customers tend to be visitors, or are locals renting e bikes too? No. 

Jonny Rockall: Yes, so I do have locals that bring family, friends and family for something to do.

They want to show them the area and uh, you know, I really appreciate the locals that, that come back and keep bringing friends and family back. Lots of visitors, Calgary, um, and visitors from our area. Uh, West Kelowna is a, is um, a busy spot that come here. And um, but yeah, travelers from all over. 

David Archer: Beyond your shop, do you think there are more locals using e bikes to get around generally?

Is that a trend that’s growing, do you think? 

Jonny Rockall: Definitely. Um, you know, when there, when there’s e bike products becoming available, um, you know, I think local stores are seeing the shift, the balance of, uh, regular bikes to e bikes, you know, that’s growing on the e bike side. The trend in general, I think worldwide is, is e bikes, you know, once people.

You know, believe that they’re not cheating. They’re getting on and they’re, they’re, they’re getting on an accessible vehicle that can achieve so much more just as far as covering ground, but also getting into the back country. I mean, I will say that about, um, uh, Vancouver area. Um, we left North Vancouver, Vancouver, and, uh, it was so busy.

It’s, you know, the traffic was crazy. It would take you hours to get anywhere. Um, and in the years that we’d left, we would go back. And each year we were away, we would then go back maybe one or two more times, and um, now we go back fairly often. And I would say that the traffic has decreased over the years.

I’m only speculating that it is because of e bikes. You know, when you line up at an intersection in Vancouver now, you’re surrounded by e bikes. And there’s, it just seems like there’s fewer cars going into Stanley Park, fewer cars downtown. And I can only imagine that it’s, uh, e bikes have an effect on that.

David Archer: Right. And it’s part of the trend toward electrification we’re seeing across the world. Let’s talk about another type of electric vehicle that is new to Vernon, the Zamboni. How are you involved with Zambonis in Vernon? 

Jonny Rockall: You know, it actually, it’s ironic that, um, my friend that got me into my firefighting job at the Mica Hydroelectric Dam also got me into my job as a Zamboni driver for the City of Vernon Arenas Department.

And, uh, he, it was just a part time job that he got, and he said I should check it out, and I started doing it, and, um, it’s great. Definitely connects me with the community, like, my kids go to school here, and they, all of their friends are always at the rink. And then, um, there is a hockey team, the Vernon Vipers, that play here, and, um, I get the, well, some would say it’s unfortunate, but, uh, but I think it’s fortunate to be able to, Do the ice at the Vipers games.

So I do a lot of those. And, um, obviously there’s lots of fans that are kids and, you know, they’re always banging on the glass when I go by and, and, um, just to, just to be in that environment, it’s, it’s, uh, it’s a lot of fun. I enjoy it. 

David Archer: Yeah, that does sound like fun for people who might not know what does a Zamboni do exactly?

Jonny Rockall: Zamboni is an ice resurfacer. So, um, there’s a couple of models, I think, in the world that, that, um, resurface ice, but the popular one is the Zamboni. Everybody knows the Zamboni. It, it’s definitely the most satisfying part of the job. You know, you, you take this ice, it’s all chewed up and it’s got snow all over it and you turn it into a nice glistening, smooth sheet of, you know, brand new ice in a matter of like six or seven or eight minutes.

And then everybody’s happy that you’ve just done it. It’s great. You know, it’s a, it’s a rewarding job in that regard for sure. 

Was this a job that you thought about as a kid growing up? I know where I grew up a lot of kids imagined themselves driving the Zamboni. 

Jonny Rockall: Oh, definitely. I mean, I, I grew up in Ottawa playing hockey on the outdoor rinks.

You know, the, the Ottawa River, our river was, had like three sheets on it that we would scrape with snow shovels and they would flood maybe once a day. But, uh, so to get, um, new ice, you know, at the drop of a hat with this, with this machine was, um, was quite something, you know, it really does. It performs quite a task in less than 10 minutes.

You’ve got, you know, a huge amount of work done. So I could, I could appreciate it from that regard, playing outdoors on the rough snowy ice, you know. 

David Archer: Yeah, it’s important. What can you tell us about Vernon’s new and retrofitted electric Zambonis? Have you gotten a chance to drive them? 

Jonny Rockall: Yeah, I spent a lot of time on them, uh, this past winter.

They are I mean, it’s It’s the same, um, benefits that you get driving an electric example, an electric car. Um, there’s many electric cars out there. You know, they’re obviously efficient, quick, uh, smooth running, little maintenance. There, there’s actually, it’s, it’s quite, after I, after I talked to you, uh, initially, I started doing some digging on, on really what the benefits of the, the Zamboni are, like where we benefit the most, and I mean, there’s a huge greenhouse gas emissions reduction.

There is, uh, the indoor air quality, because they, they were, the, they still have them, but the propane is the original, uh, method of fuel. So it, you know, it improves the inside, the indoor air quality. Uh, and I mean, what, there’s, there’s so many dynamics with an ice rink that people don’t know about. To have the ice Set and the water set on the ice quicker, they suck all the air out of the, out of the building so that, that it, it basically, it just takes the moisture, all the moisture’s leaving the building so they, so that, so that the dry surface can, can set quicker.

So in that regard, there’s exhaust fans going all the time. There’s a, there’s a massive um, air quality. Uh, system in there that’s in place that’s always working, but just even being directly around the machine when it’s running, I mean, you’re, you’re driving a machine with an exhaust pipe that’s three feet away from you around in circles, you know, in the same spot.

So there is that regard. So it decreases you, you, the, um, the CO emissions in the building increases the worker safety. reduces the greenhouse gas. Like there’s a ton of benefits and it’s pretty smooth. The, the, the drive, you’re not like dealing with a, an internal combustion motor, four cylinder motor on the original ones and they need tuning up, you know, they need spark plugs, they need, they need oil, they need, they know all that stuff and you got to check all that stuff before a shift.

Right. So, um, it’s funny because the electric motor, I mean, it’s, it’s pretty simple, but. There’s a lot of wires in there for sure. I mean, you got a massive battery and a pretty decent sized motor and you’ve got a whole crew of mechanics who are amazing at the city works yard that know how to work on vehicles, but very few of them, there’s very few electric vehicles in the city and they’ll throw in a couple of electric Zambonis and You know, we had one not start when it, when it first arrived, there was some issues just working out the bugs and, you know, the mechanics show up and they, uh, and they’re standing, leaning over the, you know, the engine bay where the engine was, but there’s a big silver box there.

And, and, and they like, they’re looking at each other and, uh, they look at me and they go, uh, so, uh, did they send an instruction manual with this thing? 

David Archer: Right. It’s like, how do we fix this thing? 

Jonny Rockall: It’s not very common, but, you know, there really isn’t a lot to go wrong with them. So going back and forth, um, immediately from one ice sheet to the other, uh, and, you know, sometimes there’s busy weekends where there’s tournaments and there’s, uh, uh, an ice clean every period, that electric system has the potential to overheat.

So you just gotta, just gotta have that ability also just to let it chill because normally when you’ve got one sheet, you’ve got an hour for it to settle down. But, um, normally under regular operating conditions, they are extremely low maintenance. There is pretty much nothing to do on them. Um, so they are environmentally friendly, uh, a lot more efficient, um, and a lot cheaper to run.

So. 

David Archer: That sounds ideal. What has been the public reaction to these machines? What are people saying about them? 

Jonny Rockall: Uh, you know, initially when we had that over, we had an overheating thing, which we, how we, how we found out about it. And of course you get all the, the old schoolers be like, ah, come on. You know, uh, this is, uh, what were they thinking?

But, um, but mostly, you know, they’re, uh, quiet, clean people that I think appreciate the fact that there’s their air quality inside this small building is, um, not being compromised. So I think in general, the, the feedback is positive, but, uh, and just to be able to, um, You know, refit an old machine. So you take out, you know, an old used up motor and now you can kind of keep this machine working.

These things aren’t cheap. They’re, you know, between a hundred and 200, 000. So to be able to update it and then have, you know, have you kind of use up this machine a little bit more and, and, um, save all that waste, that’s a good thing. 

David Archer: Do the electric vehicles handle any differently than the old ones? 

Jonny Rockall: Yeah, they’re quicker.

They’re faster for sure. So that’s nice, you know, and they’re, and it’s an actually a smoother ride when you’ve got an old four cylinder that’s, that’s, um, you know, for between 10 and 20, 30 years old, a couple of our machines are pretty old and ancient. Um, it’s just like buying a used car, you know, they just don’t run as good as when they were new.

And so now you’ve basically turned it into a new machine, a new, a new driving experience. The, the motors are very smooth. They accelerate smoothly. They don’t hiccup and burp and, you know, cause misfires or anything like that. And um, so they’re, it’s really nice to be able to just take this old machine and it drives like a brand new, brand new car.

Vernon’s definitely always trying to improve things in that regard. They’re a fairly progressive municipality and, um, I’m sure we’ll see some more changes like that in the future. 

David Archer: Are there any other innovations that you’d like to mention? 

Jonny Rockall: Vernon, I will say, also, um, you know, switched all of their hot water systems.

Zamboni uses a cold water and a hot water tank to redo the ice. Most people don’t know about how this works but, uh, there’s what you call a wash water tank which has cold water in it and it will, um, kind of rinse the ice, uh, after you’ve scraped it. And there’s a squeegee that goes over and squeegees the cold water into all the cracks and then it comes across with a nice sheet of hot water, nice, uh, nice flow of hot water that comes out.

But that hot water is, comes at a cost. You’ve got to keep, you know, multiple boilers going to, to, to keep hot water on hand all the time. So a few years ago, Vernon, um, switched to a system called Real Ice and it uses a vortex to, Spin cold water and extract air bubbles from the cold water. 

David Archer: And this system is in the Zamboni?

Jonny Rockall: No, it, it is in the fill hose for the, for the, for the flood water. So it’s on, it’s bolted to the wall. Comes, uh, from our water supply just before the water supply hits, goes into the Zamboni and it eliminates the need for hot water. Hot water. They use hot water. It’s nice because it. Each pass you have melts into the pass before, right?

So you’ve got a really nice, seamless, smooth ice sheet out there. So there’s some benefits to the cold water system that you just can’t get with hot water, but consider the cost of the hot water system. You’ve got the cost to heat the water firsthand, and then the cost of extra ice cooling. So now you’ve heated the ice surface and you have to cool it extra to get the sheet to set again, turn that hot water into cold ice and, uh, the time it takes to set the ice. So you, so when you throw in cold water system, you can have an ice sheet that sets quicker. You don’t have to heat the water beforehand. And so it’s so much more efficient in many ways. Um, all you need to do is just really, the hot water has less air bubbles because You don’t want air bubbles in the flood water, because then you’ll get, uh, softer ice.

So, it, in the old days, it would heat the water. Simple way to get the air bubbles out. You’d flood the water, uh, flood the ice, and then, um, it would take a little while to set. And then the ice, the, the, the compressor system’s working overtime to cool the ice down again. So now, you’ve got this vector, this, this, uh, tool that spins the water, spins the air out of the water, evaporates into the atmosphere, and you put, uh, It’s cold water with no air bubbles onto the ice and there you have it.

Um, so we’ve been using cold water for a few years. 

David Archer: Amazing, I’d never heard about that system. That’s really interesting. And it sounds like the electric Zambonis are performing well for you. Lower waste, lower emissions, better ride, better air quality at work, and for the arena attendees, that sounds like a win.

Jonny, thanks so much for being with us on the show today. 

Jonny Rockall: Thanks for having me. 

David Archer: This has been Travel Beyond presented by Destination Think, and I’d like to thank Johnny Rockall for taking time out of his busy summer season at the bike shop to speak with me. Thanks as well to Tourism Vernon for sponsoring this episode and to Tori Silverthorne for being our guest.

For show notes and more info, see the blog at DestinationThink. com. I’m David Archer and I produced this episode and composed its theme music. My co producer is Sarah Raymond de Booy, Lindsay Payne, Cory Price, and Jamie Sterling provided production support. You can help more people find this show by subscribing to future episodes and by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever else you happen to be listening.

I hear an electric Zamboni is a nice quiet place. Talk to you next time!